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	<title>Comments for Broken Jars</title>
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	<description>Shaping and empowering leaders,  Advancing the kingdom</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 18 Aug 2010 16:14:34 -0400</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Did I make it?? by zinzendorf</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=153&#038;cpage=1#comment-22</link>
		<dc:creator>zinzendorf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Aug 2010 16:14:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=153#comment-22</guid>
		<description>So, here I am on the 18th, still in Pennsylvania. You know, it almost seems as if there is some devilish conspiracy to block this mission trip. This time, it&#039;s a foul-up in the communications process between the two airlines involved.  Ah well, now, take off is set for the evening of the 19th with arrival, finally, in Suriname in the wee hours of Saturday, the 21st. Please, pray that the Holy Spirit run interference in this play...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, here I am on the 18th, still in Pennsylvania. You know, it almost seems as if there is some devilish conspiracy to block this mission trip. This time, it&#8217;s a foul-up in the communications process between the two airlines involved.  Ah well, now, take off is set for the evening of the 19th with arrival, finally, in Suriname in the wee hours of Saturday, the 21st. Please, pray that the Holy Spirit run interference in this play&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; by zinzendorf</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160&#038;cpage=1#comment-21</link>
		<dc:creator>zinzendorf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Aug 2010 16:09:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160#comment-21</guid>
		<description>Opinionator (above) has raised an issue about the advisability of encouraging people to engage in Muslim evangelism. He’s indicated that it may not be wise to do so without adequate preparation.  He’s absolutely right, and in highlighting the issue he gives me the opportunity to expand on it just a bit.

Just off the top of my head I can think of four elements that must somehow prelude effective Muslim evangelism. 

First is motive. “Hunger for souls” is a nice religious sounding phrase that by itself masks what true motives may be. There’s a danger that it may imply a “notch on the gun” mentality in which Muslims (or any other non-Christian for that matter) is considered an object to be won: kind of a body count mentality. I don’t consider that particularly Christian, but if “hunger for souls” implies, as it should, a longing to see people brought into a loving relationship with Jesus, a deep caring desire that they experience the best, then I think we’re getting to right motive. Do we really love Muslims?  A great deal of what I hear in conversations reflects a fear of Muslims, resentment, or an antagonism toward them. Unless love is at the root, please, forget trying to do any evangelism.

Second, love really doesn’t work unless it’s woven into relationships. I’m watching some Christian friends in Asia, and learning from them, how effective long-term love-drenched relationships can be in forming the basis for the discipleship process. Evangelism is, after all, an initiatory part in that process. Those relationships do not necessarily take months or years to develop. I’ve successfully brought Muslims to Christ on planes or in parking lots, but those conversations never begin with a assault on their faith or a crude memorized routine that identifies them as evangelistic targets. Open dialogue and the potential for real friendship are key.

Third, as Opinionator points out, “adequate preparation”.  I don’t think everyone needs a graduate degree in Islamic studies to be a successful disciple-maker but ignorance of the Koran and basic Islamic beliefs is a sure way to make an idiot of yourself. Especially in highly globalized environments many Muslims know a great deal more about Christianity than even some Christians do. Core familiarity with what they believe is essential. There are many “denominations” within Islam, as there are in Christianity, but all Muslims hold onto the Koran as essential truth. Our lack of knowledge about it reflects a disdain for what they hold sacred, and also puts us at an intellectual disadvantage. Much of my practical teaching in this area involves acquainting students with the Surah Miriam in the Koran. Never read it?? Not familiar with the “bridges” to our own faith that can be found there?? Then forget trying to intellectually or rationally power-play anyone into the Kingdom.

Fourth, how real and present is God to you? Adequate preparation is crucial, but in my experience Muslims are never won to Jesus by theology alone. Your personal experience of God, however, packs thunder into the evangelistic encounter. Do you have experiences of how wonderful, graceful, powerful, and personal our God is? In most shades of Islam, Allah is real in the theology of it all, of course but not really experiencable. There’s a hunger for what you have: share that! &quot;This is what Jesus did for me this morning&quot;: share that!

Fifth, wisdom, or listening to the Spirit. Evangelistic street smarts. Is this the right time, the right place, the right person, the right approach? Am I the person the Lord is calling to enter into this relationship/conversation? Can you read the readiness of the person you are about to share Christ with? Are the circumstances favorable? Do you have an adequate follow-up process in place and ready to continue the discipleship and nurturing that must follow?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Opinionator (above) has raised an issue about the advisability of encouraging people to engage in Muslim evangelism. He’s indicated that it may not be wise to do so without adequate preparation.  He’s absolutely right, and in highlighting the issue he gives me the opportunity to expand on it just a bit.</p>
<p>Just off the top of my head I can think of four elements that must somehow prelude effective Muslim evangelism. </p>
<p>First is motive. “Hunger for souls” is a nice religious sounding phrase that by itself masks what true motives may be. There’s a danger that it may imply a “notch on the gun” mentality in which Muslims (or any other non-Christian for that matter) is considered an object to be won: kind of a body count mentality. I don’t consider that particularly Christian, but if “hunger for souls” implies, as it should, a longing to see people brought into a loving relationship with Jesus, a deep caring desire that they experience the best, then I think we’re getting to right motive. Do we really love Muslims?  A great deal of what I hear in conversations reflects a fear of Muslims, resentment, or an antagonism toward them. Unless love is at the root, please, forget trying to do any evangelism.</p>
<p>Second, love really doesn’t work unless it’s woven into relationships. I’m watching some Christian friends in Asia, and learning from them, how effective long-term love-drenched relationships can be in forming the basis for the discipleship process. Evangelism is, after all, an initiatory part in that process. Those relationships do not necessarily take months or years to develop. I’ve successfully brought Muslims to Christ on planes or in parking lots, but those conversations never begin with a assault on their faith or a crude memorized routine that identifies them as evangelistic targets. Open dialogue and the potential for real friendship are key.</p>
<p>Third, as Opinionator points out, “adequate preparation”.  I don’t think everyone needs a graduate degree in Islamic studies to be a successful disciple-maker but ignorance of the Koran and basic Islamic beliefs is a sure way to make an idiot of yourself. Especially in highly globalized environments many Muslims know a great deal more about Christianity than even some Christians do. Core familiarity with what they believe is essential. There are many “denominations” within Islam, as there are in Christianity, but all Muslims hold onto the Koran as essential truth. Our lack of knowledge about it reflects a disdain for what they hold sacred, and also puts us at an intellectual disadvantage. Much of my practical teaching in this area involves acquainting students with the Surah Miriam in the Koran. Never read it?? Not familiar with the “bridges” to our own faith that can be found there?? Then forget trying to intellectually or rationally power-play anyone into the Kingdom.</p>
<p>Fourth, how real and present is God to you? Adequate preparation is crucial, but in my experience Muslims are never won to Jesus by theology alone. Your personal experience of God, however, packs thunder into the evangelistic encounter. Do you have experiences of how wonderful, graceful, powerful, and personal our God is? In most shades of Islam, Allah is real in the theology of it all, of course but not really experiencable. There’s a hunger for what you have: share that! &#8220;This is what Jesus did for me this morning&#8221;: share that!</p>
<p>Fifth, wisdom, or listening to the Spirit. Evangelistic street smarts. Is this the right time, the right place, the right person, the right approach? Am I the person the Lord is calling to enter into this relationship/conversation? Can you read the readiness of the person you are about to share Christ with? Are the circumstances favorable? Do you have an adequate follow-up process in place and ready to continue the discipleship and nurturing that must follow?</p>
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		<title>Comment on God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; by Carole</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160&#038;cpage=1#comment-20</link>
		<dc:creator>Carole</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Aug 2010 03:22:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160#comment-20</guid>
		<description>God&#039;s will is that all be saved and that we obey him and trust him as we reach out to others of any and all backgrounds.   

1 Timothy 3:1-14a
 But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come.
 For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy, unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good,treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these.
 For among them are those who enter into households and captivate weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses, always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, rejected in regard to the faith. But they will not make further progress; for their folly will be obvious to all, just as Jannes&#039;s and Jambres&#039;s folly was also.
  Now you followed my teaching, conduct, purpose, faith, patience, love, perseverance, persecutions, and sufferings, such as happened to me at Antioch, at Iconium and at Lystra; what persecutions I endured, and out of them all the Lord rescued me! Indeed, all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will be persecuted. But evil men and impostors will proceed from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived. You, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of...

The one line that stands out to me in this passage is &quot;for their folly will be obvious to all&quot; (v 9)  The Muslims show their true colours in situations like this.  Just as they hide among women and children instead of fighting in the open BECAUSE THEY KNOW THE AMERICANS WILL NOT KILL CIVILIAN WOMEN AND CHILDREN, now they will build a mosque in such a sensitive setting BECAUSE THEY KNOW THE LAWS OF AMERICA WILL ALLOW THEM TO. They use the righteous Judeo-Christian principles within the fabric of America to abuse Americans. But, to oppose them would be to go against those principles.  We see what they are doing, but we just have to trust God to intervene.

Carole</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>God&#8217;s will is that all be saved and that we obey him and trust him as we reach out to others of any and all backgrounds.   </p>
<p>1 Timothy 3:1-14a<br />
 But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come.<br />
 For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy, unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good,treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these.<br />
 For among them are those who enter into households and captivate weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses, always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, rejected in regard to the faith. But they will not make further progress; for their folly will be obvious to all, just as Jannes&#8217;s and Jambres&#8217;s folly was also.<br />
  Now you followed my teaching, conduct, purpose, faith, patience, love, perseverance, persecutions, and sufferings, such as happened to me at Antioch, at Iconium and at Lystra; what persecutions I endured, and out of them all the Lord rescued me! Indeed, all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will be persecuted. But evil men and impostors will proceed from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived. You, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of&#8230;</p>
<p>The one line that stands out to me in this passage is &#8220;for their folly will be obvious to all&#8221; (v 9)  The Muslims show their true colours in situations like this.  Just as they hide among women and children instead of fighting in the open BECAUSE THEY KNOW THE AMERICANS WILL NOT KILL CIVILIAN WOMEN AND CHILDREN, now they will build a mosque in such a sensitive setting BECAUSE THEY KNOW THE LAWS OF AMERICA WILL ALLOW THEM TO. They use the righteous Judeo-Christian principles within the fabric of America to abuse Americans. But, to oppose them would be to go against those principles.  We see what they are doing, but we just have to trust God to intervene.</p>
<p>Carole</p>
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		<title>Comment on God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; by ESHarz</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160&#038;cpage=1#comment-19</link>
		<dc:creator>ESHarz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Aug 2010 22:27:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160#comment-19</guid>
		<description>Should countries that ban Christian evangelistic work be allowed to fund Muslim proselytizing work in the USA?  

It appears that funding for the work, within 2 blocks of ground zero, will come from some of the same sources that supported the bombing of the towers.  “Should” has more to do with what would happen if the Holy Spirit had dominion, and Christians stood in their spiritual power.  The early church did walk in the power of the Holy Spirit, and did serve the Lord under persecution.

Can a religion that does not tolerate Christian activity be permitted to pursue its own proselytism in countries that are not traditionally Islamic?

It can and it will.  Not only does our culture’s political correctness demand it, but the more we fight it, as a society, the more Islam will grow.  Our deepest growth may still come when we are outlawed in this country, because faith without testing holds far less commitment.

Governor Patterson (NY) has offered to give the mosque land to build on away from sensitive areas around Ground Zero? Would you support the expenditure of taxpayer funds for such a purpose?

I would not.  But I believe, the people of Islam may be smarter than they are greedy.  They know they want to set the rules and remain in control.  They will not accept this governments gifts if they have to acknowledge those gifts.

And most importantly, what do you think Christians, the Missio Dei on one side and Islamic law on the other, should do? In other words, should Christians evangelize Muslims?

True Christians have no choice.  We will die to try to save them, even as they die to kill us.  In that difference some will see the truth between the true God, and the enemy of their souls.

What has kept global Christians from accomplishing their task, and what do you think should be done about that?

We have lacked unity, lacked the willingness to sacrifice, and lacked in our stand on Truth.  As we grow in faith together to spiritually possess the land, no matter the costs, we will naturally support each other with everything the Holy Spirit gives us.  Spreading the gospel of our Lord Jesus to all people will follow as it did in Surinam. 

What’s God’s will in this matter?

We shall soon see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Should countries that ban Christian evangelistic work be allowed to fund Muslim proselytizing work in the USA?  </p>
<p>It appears that funding for the work, within 2 blocks of ground zero, will come from some of the same sources that supported the bombing of the towers.  “Should” has more to do with what would happen if the Holy Spirit had dominion, and Christians stood in their spiritual power.  The early church did walk in the power of the Holy Spirit, and did serve the Lord under persecution.</p>
<p>Can a religion that does not tolerate Christian activity be permitted to pursue its own proselytism in countries that are not traditionally Islamic?</p>
<p>It can and it will.  Not only does our culture’s political correctness demand it, but the more we fight it, as a society, the more Islam will grow.  Our deepest growth may still come when we are outlawed in this country, because faith without testing holds far less commitment.</p>
<p>Governor Patterson (NY) has offered to give the mosque land to build on away from sensitive areas around Ground Zero? Would you support the expenditure of taxpayer funds for such a purpose?</p>
<p>I would not.  But I believe, the people of Islam may be smarter than they are greedy.  They know they want to set the rules and remain in control.  They will not accept this governments gifts if they have to acknowledge those gifts.</p>
<p>And most importantly, what do you think Christians, the Missio Dei on one side and Islamic law on the other, should do? In other words, should Christians evangelize Muslims?</p>
<p>True Christians have no choice.  We will die to try to save them, even as they die to kill us.  In that difference some will see the truth between the true God, and the enemy of their souls.</p>
<p>What has kept global Christians from accomplishing their task, and what do you think should be done about that?</p>
<p>We have lacked unity, lacked the willingness to sacrifice, and lacked in our stand on Truth.  As we grow in faith together to spiritually possess the land, no matter the costs, we will naturally support each other with everything the Holy Spirit gives us.  Spreading the gospel of our Lord Jesus to all people will follow as it did in Surinam. </p>
<p>What’s God’s will in this matter?</p>
<p>We shall soon see.</p>
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		<title>Comment on God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; by Opinionator</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160&#038;cpage=1#comment-18</link>
		<dc:creator>Opinionator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Aug 2010 14:29:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160#comment-18</guid>
		<description>Contrary to what many think, Islam is not monolithic. Just as in Christianity and other major world faiths, Islam has a great deal of variety. Sufi Islam, for example, has significant differences with Shia or Wahhabi Islam. Sufi Muslims, in fact, have been the targets recently of the Taliban in Pakistan, with killings and mosque bombings. Just as one cannot paint with a broad brush in describing the Christian faith as practiced by its various denominations, neither can one do so with Islam. There are important differences between Catholics, Baptists and Methodists; so too between various groups of Muslims.

The most important need in a war is to know who your enemy is. In the war on terror, Islam is not the enemy. The enemy is those radicalized elements within Islam who plot and carry out terrorist acts against the west and those who want to be at peace with the west (which is why there is quite a bit of Muslim on Muslim  violence).

The proposed Islamic cultural center/mosque in Manhattan is a project of a Sufi Muslim cleric. It&#039;s hard to imagine that the radical Muslims are really happy about the building of an Islamic center whose purpose is to build better relations between Islam and the west. For the Taliban and Al Qaeda, the west is the enemy.

True to the U.S. Constitution, the building of a mosque within two blocks of Ground Zero is certainly permissible. But as Paul said in another context to the Corinthians, &quot;everything is permissible, but not everything is beneficial.&quot; An Islamic center in Manhattan, dedicated to improving relations between Islam and the west is surely a permissible thing, but building it so close to the hallowed ground where thousands of people lost their lives to Islamist terrorists is not a beneficial thing. President Obama struck the right chord in his two statements -- one in which he affirmed the constitutionality of the question and the other in which he hinted at its advisability.

I agree that the question of funding for this project is perhaps the most important question. I hope someone will follow the money to its source. Large amounts from Muslim governments that do not allow any meaningful rights to Christians is very problematic, and could well be the undoing of this project.

Finally, evangelizing Muslims is surely an appropriate task of those Christians who are called and have trained for it. Again, we must know those we want to evangelize. As always, today there are evangelistic methods that do more harm than good, and that is probably no more true than in Muslim evangelism. It may not be wise to suggest to a Christian congregation in a predominantly Muslim country that they have a biblical obligation to evangelize Muslims without also carefully preparing them to do so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Contrary to what many think, Islam is not monolithic. Just as in Christianity and other major world faiths, Islam has a great deal of variety. Sufi Islam, for example, has significant differences with Shia or Wahhabi Islam. Sufi Muslims, in fact, have been the targets recently of the Taliban in Pakistan, with killings and mosque bombings. Just as one cannot paint with a broad brush in describing the Christian faith as practiced by its various denominations, neither can one do so with Islam. There are important differences between Catholics, Baptists and Methodists; so too between various groups of Muslims.</p>
<p>The most important need in a war is to know who your enemy is. In the war on terror, Islam is not the enemy. The enemy is those radicalized elements within Islam who plot and carry out terrorist acts against the west and those who want to be at peace with the west (which is why there is quite a bit of Muslim on Muslim  violence).</p>
<p>The proposed Islamic cultural center/mosque in Manhattan is a project of a Sufi Muslim cleric. It&#8217;s hard to imagine that the radical Muslims are really happy about the building of an Islamic center whose purpose is to build better relations between Islam and the west. For the Taliban and Al Qaeda, the west is the enemy.</p>
<p>True to the U.S. Constitution, the building of a mosque within two blocks of Ground Zero is certainly permissible. But as Paul said in another context to the Corinthians, &#8220;everything is permissible, but not everything is beneficial.&#8221; An Islamic center in Manhattan, dedicated to improving relations between Islam and the west is surely a permissible thing, but building it so close to the hallowed ground where thousands of people lost their lives to Islamist terrorists is not a beneficial thing. President Obama struck the right chord in his two statements &#8212; one in which he affirmed the constitutionality of the question and the other in which he hinted at its advisability.</p>
<p>I agree that the question of funding for this project is perhaps the most important question. I hope someone will follow the money to its source. Large amounts from Muslim governments that do not allow any meaningful rights to Christians is very problematic, and could well be the undoing of this project.</p>
<p>Finally, evangelizing Muslims is surely an appropriate task of those Christians who are called and have trained for it. Again, we must know those we want to evangelize. As always, today there are evangelistic methods that do more harm than good, and that is probably no more true than in Muslim evangelism. It may not be wise to suggest to a Christian congregation in a predominantly Muslim country that they have a biblical obligation to evangelize Muslims without also carefully preparing them to do so.</p>
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		<title>Comment on God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; by Arnie Petrosino</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160&#038;cpage=1#comment-17</link>
		<dc:creator>Arnie Petrosino</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Aug 2010 06:05:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160#comment-17</guid>
		<description>Gods Mission and the Mosque
1.	Muslim countries should not be allowed to fund anything in this country.  We have freedom of religion, not freedom of infiltration, in our country. Muslim countries, that only allow Islam in their country, have let us know in no uncertain terms that they want us destroyed. They use the mosques to harbor militants who would do us harm. Many  Muslims are non-violent  but if you ask them if they believe in the Qur&#039;an they will tell you that they do. The Qur,an preaches death to non-Muslims if they do not convert to Islam. (This sounds familiar .)
2.	People of the Muslim beliefs living peacefully in this country should have the same rights as other religions. If the government is allowed to restrict one religion they can restrict all religions. The difference in the answer to one is the funding  buy other countries. He who has the money dictates the actions of he who gets the money!
3.	Taxpayer money should not be used to build a mosque any more than to build a church. (See answer 2)
4.	We should absolutely should evangelize Muslims, with a passion.
5.	I not so sure that the task is not being accomplished. The work is slow because of many bumps in the road. Fear being the biggest bump in Muslim countries where they kill and torture you for trying to convert a Muslim to Christianity. The killing isn’t too bad it’s the torture that scares me!
6.	God loves you and God loves me and God loves Muslims! God forgives you and God forgives me and God forgives Muslims. God wants us to forgive others as He forgives us. So I think God would want us to show our love and forgiveness to the Muslims and show them what Jesus Christ is all about! Let them build their mosque where they will.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gods Mission and the Mosque<br />
1.	Muslim countries should not be allowed to fund anything in this country.  We have freedom of religion, not freedom of infiltration, in our country. Muslim countries, that only allow Islam in their country, have let us know in no uncertain terms that they want us destroyed. They use the mosques to harbor militants who would do us harm. Many  Muslims are non-violent  but if you ask them if they believe in the Qur&#8217;an they will tell you that they do. The Qur,an preaches death to non-Muslims if they do not convert to Islam. (This sounds familiar .)<br />
2.	People of the Muslim beliefs living peacefully in this country should have the same rights as other religions. If the government is allowed to restrict one religion they can restrict all religions. The difference in the answer to one is the funding  buy other countries. He who has the money dictates the actions of he who gets the money!<br />
3.	Taxpayer money should not be used to build a mosque any more than to build a church. (See answer 2)<br />
4.	We should absolutely should evangelize Muslims, with a passion.<br />
5.	I not so sure that the task is not being accomplished. The work is slow because of many bumps in the road. Fear being the biggest bump in Muslim countries where they kill and torture you for trying to convert a Muslim to Christianity. The killing isn’t too bad it’s the torture that scares me!<br />
6.	God loves you and God loves me and God loves Muslims! God forgives you and God forgives me and God forgives Muslims. God wants us to forgive others as He forgives us. So I think God would want us to show our love and forgiveness to the Muslims and show them what Jesus Christ is all about! Let them build their mosque where they will.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Harmony and Heartache by God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; &#171; Broken Jars</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=104&#038;cpage=1#comment-16</link>
		<dc:creator>God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; &#171; Broken Jars</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Aug 2010 01:58:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=104#comment-16</guid>
		<description>[...] Take a look at a previous post for additional perspectives on this &#8211; - &#8211; &#8220;Harmony and Heartache&#8220; [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Take a look at a previous post for additional perspectives on this &#8211; &#8211; &#8211; &#8220;Harmony and Heartache&#8220; [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; by Judy Goddard</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160&#038;cpage=1#comment-15</link>
		<dc:creator>Judy Goddard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Aug 2010 01:04:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160#comment-15</guid>
		<description>I didn&#039;t think long about these questions.  I suppose there are huge holes in my thinking, but it might encourage discussion.
Judy

Should countries that ban Christian evangelistic work be allowed to fund Muslim proselytizing work in the USA?

The laws of the usa do not restrict freedom of religion. (in terms of gaining followers)  Even though, in other parts of the world, Christians are prevented from spreading the good news, it has no bearing on what goes on here.  Ideally, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, all would be prevented from proselytizing in the usa.  There is no “tit for tat” that would apply.
If any country is in good standing, not having it’s assets frozen and not breaking any laws, there’s nothing to be said.

2. Can a religion that does not tolerate Christian activity be permitted to pursue its own proselytism in countries that are not traditionally Islamic?

I do not know if the usa and other countries have laws that inform this question.  In the EU, are there blanket laws that cover this question?  Or does each country have it’s own say in how religions gain followers?  We have to work within the structures of our governments.  That is, unless we seek to achieve our objectives through civil disobedience.  Of course, change can occur through democratic means, by voting for legislators who favor our view point.
Ultimately, though, God is the one who makes a way.


Governor Patterson (NY) has offered to give the mosque land to build on away from sensitive areas around Ground Zero? Would you support the expenditure of taxpayer funds for such a purpose?
Absolutely not!  How can any self respecting democrat suggest using tax payer money to support any religion in this way??


And most importantly, what do you think Christians, the Missio Dei on one side and Islamic law on the other, should do? In other words, should Christians evangelize Muslims?

What should we do?  What should I do?  Take every opportunity that the Lord gives us to show love to muslims and so give a chance to see what it’s like to have a God who loves us and who we can love in return.

What has kept global Christians from accomplishing their task, and what do you think should be done about that?

I truly do think that the misinterpretaion of the laws of separation of church and state tie our hands.  Once again, our options seem to be limited to civil disobedience, changing legislation or blatant disregard for the law. (with all that that would include.)
People need to have a heart hunger to see the world saved.  But not that only. They (we) need to be willing to get our hands dirty, to take risk, to understand that life is dangerous and there is no 
guarantee of physical safety.  Who wants to be a martyr? 

What’s God’s will?
To see all men saved.  To see all men live in peace.  For God’s kingdom to reign on earth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t think long about these questions.  I suppose there are huge holes in my thinking, but it might encourage discussion.<br />
Judy</p>
<p>Should countries that ban Christian evangelistic work be allowed to fund Muslim proselytizing work in the USA?</p>
<p>The laws of the usa do not restrict freedom of religion. (in terms of gaining followers)  Even though, in other parts of the world, Christians are prevented from spreading the good news, it has no bearing on what goes on here.  Ideally, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, all would be prevented from proselytizing in the usa.  There is no “tit for tat” that would apply.<br />
If any country is in good standing, not having it’s assets frozen and not breaking any laws, there’s nothing to be said.</p>
<p>2. Can a religion that does not tolerate Christian activity be permitted to pursue its own proselytism in countries that are not traditionally Islamic?</p>
<p>I do not know if the usa and other countries have laws that inform this question.  In the EU, are there blanket laws that cover this question?  Or does each country have it’s own say in how religions gain followers?  We have to work within the structures of our governments.  That is, unless we seek to achieve our objectives through civil disobedience.  Of course, change can occur through democratic means, by voting for legislators who favor our view point.<br />
Ultimately, though, God is the one who makes a way.</p>
<p>Governor Patterson (NY) has offered to give the mosque land to build on away from sensitive areas around Ground Zero? Would you support the expenditure of taxpayer funds for such a purpose?<br />
Absolutely not!  How can any self respecting democrat suggest using tax payer money to support any religion in this way??</p>
<p>And most importantly, what do you think Christians, the Missio Dei on one side and Islamic law on the other, should do? In other words, should Christians evangelize Muslims?</p>
<p>What should we do?  What should I do?  Take every opportunity that the Lord gives us to show love to muslims and so give a chance to see what it’s like to have a God who loves us and who we can love in return.</p>
<p>What has kept global Christians from accomplishing their task, and what do you think should be done about that?</p>
<p>I truly do think that the misinterpretaion of the laws of separation of church and state tie our hands.  Once again, our options seem to be limited to civil disobedience, changing legislation or blatant disregard for the law. (with all that that would include.)<br />
People need to have a heart hunger to see the world saved.  But not that only. They (we) need to be willing to get our hands dirty, to take risk, to understand that life is dangerous and there is no<br />
guarantee of physical safety.  Who wants to be a martyr? </p>
<p>What’s God’s will?<br />
To see all men saved.  To see all men live in peace.  For God’s kingdom to reign on earth.</p>
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		<title>Comment on God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; by Judy Goddard</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160&#038;cpage=1#comment-14</link>
		<dc:creator>Judy Goddard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Aug 2010 00:07:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160#comment-14</guid>
		<description>ruminating.   I will return.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ruminating.   I will return.</p>
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		<title>Comment on God&#8217;s Mission and &#8230; &#8220;the mosque&#8221; by Fr. Richard F. Davidson, FSGG</title>
		<link>http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160&#038;cpage=1#comment-13</link>
		<dc:creator>Fr. Richard F. Davidson, FSGG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 20:22:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brokenjars.org/?p=160#comment-13</guid>
		<description>Countries, forgive my typing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Countries, forgive my typing.</p>
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